Can we not do the “I bet so and so, thinks so and so?”. It just seems kinda shallow.

best I can do is $400

I believe the phrase “Why then is extremist, explicitly Nazi rhetoric so pervasive within the Republican ranks?” is a far more complex phrase than you leave it to be. For one, we lack any objective way to gauge the overall opinions. All methods of gauging this (to my current knowledge) at all, have inherent issues.

The methods I know of are: Personal Experience, Media Coverage, Questionnaire studies, and the opinions of the leaders. Personal experience has to many unrelated variables at play. Were do you live? Who do you talk to? What are the people you talk with willing to talk to you about?

Media coverage can be extremely biased as it is often times more profitable to focus on the number of eyes that you get, versus the accuracy of your information. Media coverage is also not focused on representing society. It makes more sense to report on a single important incident, than it is to report 100 quiet days were nothing happened.

Questionnaires would normally be a good method and it normally would be. However, there are a lot of variables at play. How was the data gathered, is it peer reviewed, what measures were taken to prevent the inherent biases (either from the researchers, or by the nature of the current method studying), what is the sample size? This would be the best way to categorize the party as a whole, should the correct measures be taken. I have a had a lot of trouble finding solid studies that strayed away from this, as the current landscape of political questionnaires and studies are full of studies containing these flaws. Note: If you have found a good study that takes the necessary precautions, I would be grateful if you shared it. I should also note, that I’m not exactly a professional fact checker and I do not know all the best ways to find these studies.

The opinions of the leaders of a given party can also be a great way to gauge. However this necessitates that all members of the party agree with their current leader. Not all republicans want to vote for trump, or may not be paying enough attention to be knowledgeable about him (As much as we argue and it does in fact matter who you vote for. America seems to have grown a sub culture of people who are mostly dis-interested in politics. My belief is that it is most likely either people who do not care about politics, or people that trust their overall government and fellow man enough to make the decisions for him in such matters).

Another thing is that there are many “sub-parties”, if you will, under republicans. I have seen traditionalist republicans argue with libertarian republicans. I have seen republicans who refuse to budge an inch on guns, debate republicans who believe gun control is necessary. I have seen republicans who hate the war on drugs, debate republicans who think alcohol should be banned. I believe the reason that we see a more unified message among-st the republican party is due to the general state of politics in america.

I believe the biggest reason for this unification in message; is because the transition of politicians to more of a focus on careers, rather than directly fighting for what you believe in. A great example is how most republican candidates have tried to get endorsements from trump, because they new he was popular and it would help there image. Lobbying is a huge industry at the moment, encouraging both republicans and democrats to vote differently.

I believe the second biggest reason is need for traction to get started. To win an election you need votes, to get votes you need money, to get money you need a source to get money from. If you’re rich, great! You’ll be among the few who get a chance to risk throwing money away for the hope of maybe making this country better. If you’re not a wealthy person (who as a population, appear to be less concerned with politics and more concerned with business.), than you can try to start small and try to talk to everyone to get them to spread your name. This can be a very slow process and also carries with it the risk of failure, as you may be a liability to future employers and you might be seen as evil by some. The final option is to pander. Try to get other political candidates to endorse you, and build connections. The downside is that you have to not only worry about what is best for the country/state/city, you now have to worry about how it will look to everyone else if you openly fight against the very people who built your political career.

Why do people who disagree with their party just vote for another party like the green party. The most common message that I hear is this: Voting for someone does nothing if they will never be elected. Most other parties are almost completely ignored. Thus my best option is to vote for the politicians closest to my beliefs, from the bigger republican party.

The current state of republican politics also makes it difficult to describe them through a study. Because of the sub-factions that exist, who may disagree heavily republican voting as a whole. Such people who would only vote for someone they believe is making the party a better party. This means that even if there is an over 50% population of republicans who are Nazis: there may still be “sub-parties” who act almost in-dependently from the republican party, excluding only the title of republican.

This is why I, and many republicans that I know, will agree with you that there is a dangerous group of Nazis within the republican party. There will be a dis-agreement as to how bad the situation is, but this the threat of Nazis is a commonly known fact. I think the use of this fact as a counterpoint to all republicans beliefs, has made many republicans afraid to say or admit how bad the situation is (out of fear that you will completely ignore any points they have to make. especially if they are one of these sub-parites). I also know republicans who refuse to vote for Donald Trump because of his handling of the Charlottesville incident, among other things.

I merely believe it to be more constructive to encourage republicans to look for the evils in there own party, just as democrats should within their own as well. While also trying to break down the adversarial nature of modern politics, as many people on both sides have a bad habit of shutting down when confronted, and encouraging collaborative political discussion.

P.S.

1. there are some errors in gammar and spelling I have to hop off now and I plan to fix them tomorrow.

2. Some of the language I used did not meet the standard that I am asking for from the final paragraph. As much as I hate to admit it, most of my other comments here were made while I was triggered. One of the few things that I hate this much about modern politics, has to be the over generalization and dismal of political beliefs made with arguments that do not actually question the policies or specific politicians. This is not an excuse for the way I went about commenting, and I want to condemn the way I spoke earlier. I only leave those comments up because I believe others have a right to see how the conversation got to this point, and how I have handled myself in the past.

I apologize about the mis-understanding.

We both agree on the fact that there are Nazis within the republican party, and I believe we both agree on the dangers associated with that. The mere goal of my argument was such: “Not all republicans are Nazis, therefore we should be careful with how we address them. We should avoid dismissing them on the mere basis that some may be bad actors and instead engage in a different line of reasoning.”

The portion you quoted, “Calling such people Nazis is counter productive and only inflames the current issues at hand.”, had some very important context. “Such people” in this case, was referring only to the portion of republicans who were not bad actors and were voting in good faith.

The following is my more fleshed out thoughts on the manner.

To better explain my ideas on the matter, I think it is best if I explain my trajectory from generic conservative to were I am now. So please bare with me. I know I’m giving you my whole life’s story, but I think it is important to show what I mean.

My first political ideology that I ever adopted was freedom of speech and the value of free thought. This was before I new what republicans, democrats, socialists, capitalists, etc. My reasoning was that we, as humans, are fundamentally imperfect. My general assumption is that I most likely hold at least one incorrect belief, and my constant goal is to find this belief and correct myself. This means I want to talk with others I disagree with and I want to understand why they believe what they believe. I want to challange my own beliefs. And even if I believe others are wrong, understanding their beliefs helps me to better understand my own beliefs; as I will better understand the pitfalls and weak points in my own beliefs.

The first introduction I had with politics was when my parents recommended to me Ben Shapiro. At first I agreed with a lot of his beliefs and I had found him generally reasonable. There was one section of politics that I disagreed with him however. Particularly his approach to transgender politics. I didn’t agree or disagree with him on many of his policies, as I know very little about the physiology at play and I pushed that in my “to be researched” set of opinions. However what I was able to pick a bone with, was his general attitude towards transgender people. He didn’t just say that many topics relating to transgender people where nuanced and needed to be taken with care, he seemed to assume that any pro transgender law was an attack on cis people (this is not what he outright says, but I think it is a serviceable description for the purposes of this discussion). It only got worse when he actually conversed with transgender people in debate. His outright refusal to even refer to them by their pronouns, and sometimes emphasis on not calling by their pronouns, was confusing to me. I noticed that he never really explained this outside of that It would be implicitly agreeing with them.

It was that lack of an honest discussion that really bugged me. This allowed me to notice that this was a pattern with Ben Shapiro. He would rant about what he dislikes, and only ever provide surface level discussion. Becoming my first experience with modern republican culture.

However, I still often agreed with his points and I still held my same beliefs. Never the less, I did eventually find people who would go further into detail on their beliefs.

Overtime I noticed though, how they would complain about being labeled bigots and nazis (without ever being given a justification. Or only ever seeing the clips of people who don’t know what those words mean). The problem was that they were doing the same thing back, using words like woke or liberals. Leading me to become someone who agreed politically with them, but I hated the way they went about things. My main focus of discussion with them was to encourage them to talk in a more productive manner and to avoid just using woke and liberal as a way to write someone off.

The turning point for me had to be one trip I had with my Dad. We went to a “prepper” camp, ie we played with ham radios, did some metal working, and camped out in the woods (it was a lot of fun). Towards the end, there was going to be a republican speaker who I had heard good things about and was already considering voting for. Most of his speech was one that I could agree with at the time. Even if our beliefs didn’t line up 1:1 and it was going well. Than he said one line “I want more of our children to be praying in school”. I took some offense to this as I am a strong believer in the separation of church and state but I assumed it was likely just a slip of the tongue in an otherwise solid speech. He was accepting questions after the speech, so I thought I would ask him to clarify.

What followed was one of the most eerie situations I have ever experienced. I asked him something along the lines of “I remember you noted, that you wanted more children to be praying in school. I just wanted to clarify as to whether you meant that you don’t want christian children feeling shame about praying in school.”. I forget his exact words but it was something along the lines of “I think you’re a misguided liberal and I hope you see the error of your way”, which is a bit of a shell shock for someone who very much a republican supporter. Before I could say anything else, or had a chance to explain to him that this was a small detail and that we were mostly aligned politically, I was assured away with two women (I assume were part of his campaign team) who interrogated me. Eventually they realized that I was someone that agreed with them and they backed off.

Past this point, I became acutely aware that most republicans were not interested in thoughtful discussion. They wanted their dopamine and then take off.

As to why many of my opinions have changed, I credit this both to my attempt to be open minded and the fact that all of this happened more when I was still just getting my ideological footing (so to speak).

The reason I disagree with you is because I have met similar people who voted democrat, and I have met republicans who hold themselves to a higher standard than this. I attribute labeling and finger pointing to both sides and the darker sides of general human nature. At this time, I recognize the danger that there are Nazis in republican ranks. However I don’t think it is as black and white as that.

Republicans see a similar danger among-st democrats. As a lot of the media they see and share involves BLM riots burning houses, or crazy laws that would destroy what they hold dear. And even if I dis-agree with many republican points and beliefs. I see why they think the way they do. And it would be hard to argue with them given the current state of media, were nothing can just be the facts. It has to be a pro republican or a pro democrat spin. It’s one of the main reasons I have trouble getting a solid foothold on my beliefs of socialism versus capitalism.

Ultimately I know people who earnestly hold these beliefs and have been one at one time. I know that the version of me who was disgusted with the current state of how republicans act, while agreeing with their policies. And I know how earlier me would be disgusted at the idea of Nazis and believe my best course of action was to hunt Nazis out of my own party. That’s why I want to be specific about how we address them. Because calling them Nazis, when they earnestly understand and hate the ideology, only paints you as someone who refuses to understand them. Rather than someone who wants to partner with them to make the world a better place.

P.S. I feel the last line may come across as somewhat judgmental, I only word it that way because I feel it best describes my feeling. I still am open to being corrected, and would be glad if you have more to add.

Thank you for the reply.

As for my grammar: Sometimes I have trouble putting my thoughts on paper. I half blame it on being “noschooled” where I was given a lot less writing assignments (I will note that it wasn’t all bad, as I channeled all that time into programming and computers. Thus making me better in my field than my peers. I think it has pros and cons, I plan to better explain my thoughts in a later comment). I also heavily use autocomplete. However I’m normally a better writer if I give myself time to review my work (I have gone through and made multiple edits on my comments). The other half I blame on me rushing to explain my ideas. I’m not used to the forum format and I was rushing myself before the post became irrelevant. I plan to take more time in the future when commenting on forums regardless of whether my comment becomes irrelevant. As I now see that harm it causes, and how I appear to others.

As to Nazis using their ideology as a cover. It is fully plausible and I do not have any retorts to that statement.

I have a habit of avoiding good/bad words such as Nazi/Woke/Socalist/Etc unless I can prove your arguments line up. I find that most people will shutdown around these words. Most republicans I speak with will ignore everything you have to say, if they hear a phrase like “Republicans are Nazis”. It’s also why it is so hard to talk with them.

A lot of the reason why they see opposing viewpoints automatically in a negative light, I believe is due to them only ever hearing the “Republicans are Nazis” part. I have never heard the reasoning why, people thought this (outside of REPUBLICAN BAD!). I (and I assume many republicans, as I never hear them talking about this point. Family or on the internet) will ever hear anything like what you have explained to me on the matter.

I still think it is wise to not address republicans as Nazis, as this often rings as a generalization that causes the conversation to be unproductive. I still think it is best to address their beliefs on their own merit; as I believe the best way to expose an idiot, is to explain how they are an idiot in a calm manner. Only describing the nature of Nazism and how it effects their voter base, emphasizing that not all republicans are necessarily Nazis. However, I have both learned from your comment and realized how I was not following my own beliefs in fear of being ignored. Thank you for taking the time to talk with me.

Quick note: I’m tired right now (12:30am atm) and I just wanted to update the conversation as to not leave it at that. I will go over this post and fix any issues and expand on it tomorrow when I am properly rested.

Key word “well meaning conservatives” my argument is that we should not label said conservatives as Nazis or their group as Nazis because that’s not what their about. They may have Nazis in their party, and Nazis may be encouraging certain policies. However it is bad faith to call them Nazis. As with the 30 years of experience, that’s fair. I have a relatively short knowledge on modern politics. With how almost all media is biased one way or the other, my young age, and my lack of time due to college: many of my opinions I still consider a work in progress and I’m still researching them out. Most debates I have are about what I see in front of me at the moment. What I see in front of me is well meaning republicans who ignore me when I disagree with them, because I’m a woke liberal who is going to call them a Nazi (even when we agree). I just want people to stop labeling because it just leads to more hatred when we should be able to talk it out like adults.

I’m talking about it from a ideology point of view. The truth is that the hatred did most likely lead them into their opinions and may be the real reason they adopted these viewpoints. However, from the standpoint of “Why are Nazi’s wrong?” it is this biggest issue with their ideology. As to “Conservative values are based on using power in any way to achieve their goal; If you think that their contradictory, scapegoating, culture wars make no sense, its because you aren’t looking at it simply enough. they lie and get what they want each step of the way.”. Again we are talking about them from an ideology standpoint, the reason they claim to do what they do. To argue them on a different basis, I believe, is a bad faith argument. The only thing I believe I can do is, debate them at what they say and hold them to what they say. Because there may be republicans that hold there beliefs honestly and it would be unjust for me to label them as Nazis. As to “conservative lies” about communism and socialism, I do not know what you are specifically talking about (The only conservative speaker I have listened to was Ben Shapiro. I didn’t listen to much of him as it seems he is only interested in parroting the opinions of his constituents in a way that sounds smart rather than thinking for himself). I know that both capitalism and socialism have both failed under certain circumstances (biggest examples are modern america and the USSR), and both had pros and cons. I see from an ethics viewpoint that socialism has a better grounding. I believe in unions and workers standing up for themselves. However government involvement has had a history of failures and a socialist system is something that would need to be implemented very careful or may be impossible. I will note that I have not been able to find many sources that honestly cover the topic in good faith (IE anything other than CAPITALISM SUCKS or SOCIALISM SUCKS!) that I have a very weak ground to stand on when talking about the topic. Because of this, I still see my opinions as developing in this area.

Which republican candidate? And I don’t wanna be the “SoUrCe!” guy. But anyone can make up some BS, I even almost fell into that hole myself. I ask as I don’t recall any major republican openly saying this or pushing for a bill that would effectively do this. And even if there is a republican politician that is open about this, I would wonder what there traction was with the rest of the party. Because anyone can call themselves a republican, we would need to prove that such an individual has had enough backing as to be able to represent the rest of the party before we could make a generalization.

Who cares. How are they voting now. Are they bad now or good now. Both parties have changed drastically from the inception.

Again, both sides have egg on their face. Democrats will throw up a bunch of nothing burger laws that either do nothing to solve issues (like gun laws that anyone with any knowledge of firearms knows will be circumvented with ease, assuming that throwing money at the welfare system will solve issues with how it is often handled corruptly or can have unforeseen consequences), or they will commit crimes (see Joe Biden). The current state of politics is everyone is evil, people have just decided to vote for who the think is the lesser of two evils. Also I think this may be a difference in experience, as most of the republicans I have met are very much against Nazism. Such is the difficulty with generalizations, who’s right? WHO KNOWS! All we know is that we hate the other guy.

see https://pawb.social/comment/921213 where I answer a similar comment

After reading more of the comments, I think we may be at a mis-understanding. I believe that many people mean to say that the republican party appears to be voting in a similar manner to that of Nazi’s and as such should receive zero support. Not that everyone who votes republican is necessarily a Nazi. The argument however is the the republican voter base may be mis-guided, or down right dum, but are not necessarily Nazis.

I think it would be better put as nonconstructive. It is this exact environment that fascism and other hateful ideologies, like to expand in. Where opinions are suppressed on the merit of, “their bad”, Instead of using the environment as a constructive place to display why that opinion is bad. Propaganda is most effective when all conversation is stopped.

I’m making a second comment because I believe I have a better way of putting this. We both accept that there is a certain % of republicans that are Nazis. I am merely making the argument that there is a % of republicans who are not. We should not condemn the % of not Nazis just because a certain % of the republican party is made up of Nazis. If you disagree on this basis or I am mis-understanding you, please respond as I would like to know more.

It’s the root of why they did that. This one single flaw, is what caused them to commit those acts. There is a difference between proximal and root causes. Say my boat is sinking. The proximal issue is that the boat is sinking (the problem I want to fix), the root cause is that there is a hole in my boat (what is causing my problem). The proximal issue with Nazis is that they murder millions and committed horrible acts. The root cause why they did these things, was because they generalized these groups to the point that genocide seemed reasonable to themselves. Instead of looking at the contexts or considering that there are other morals at play.

I’m going to quote someone else in the comment section. Fuck republican, Fuck democrats. You are dealing with to evil sides, of which everyone must choose the lesser of two evils.

Before you read. I made an edit to this post. Because I think editing your posts to cover up your mistakes is a wimp way to handle things: I revised the section like this: [“old text” -> “new text”]. START: They do not talk like a Nazi: they rarely include rhetoric such as how they hate other races (unless they are already a Nazi). They do not act like a Nazi: Most republicans (regardless of what twitter says) do not go around burning people, or calling others beneath them. They do not sympathize with Nazis: The root of all Nazist beliefs is that races are incapable of cooperation. Most republicans believe in a [“strong constitution, and family values.” -> “strong constitution, family values and freedom. They however do not include the belief that races must be against each other”] The reason why many Nazis vote republican is because republicans are as close as Nazis are going to get. However they are two very different ideologies with very different thought processes. Call a spade a spade, a Nazi a Nazi, and a Republican a republican. If you hate their ideas, than let your voice be heard. I will be the first to wine about republican policies. However, whatever you do. Do not stoop so far as to fall back to labeling and name calling like middle-schoolers. Who don’t know enough to engage in actual thought. And to assume that all republicans are nazis, is a bad faith argument and will leave you ignored.

Edit: Removed a swear word before “middle-schoolers” as I said it out of frustration and after cooling down, I believe it detracts from the current conversation.

To be devils advocate here. It still does not impeach on free speech. You are still capable of sharing your ideas to others. The only reason they leave it as an exception is because they believe it to be sexual in nature, as most republicans just assume the homosexuality is always sexual. Is it a bad take. Yes. However I wouldn’t want my children being handed novels of straight people having sex either. The point against republicans is that the presence homosexual relationships, does not necessitate sexual behavior. It is not free speech that is the issue with their opinion. I will note that there are some better examples were some republicans have been anti free speech (cough bud light…). I think it has less to do with republicanism, and more about our political system as a whole. I see both sides just get mad about whatever is “against” them. I have seen both sides to do evil and ignore there own values temporarily (I think someone coined a term for this kind of thing, I think it was “double think”?). I think it is important to encourage people to think, and to not let their political candidates define them, like it’s a football game or a dystopian novel.

I think what is important is the accusations that you are making. Everyone (Nazis, Republicans, Democrats, Communists, etc) are people. They may be sick, decrepit, evil people, but they are people non the less and they still react like people. If you call a republican who hates Nazi’s a Nazi, they will ignore you thinking you to be an idiot incapable of even understanding the roots of their values. Why not just leave it at “A lot of republican policies have a grave harm to the american people. They impoverish the impoverished, enrich the rich, lead to countless avoidable deaths, and even though not intended to target LGBTQ+ people, they gravely effect these communities and their members. I think it is unwise to vote republican given their current methods of governance”. This will accurately describe the negatives of this party, you could go on to better explain the pitfalls of many of their policies, and you would do so in a way that a republican voter won’t go home and say “I ran into this crazy woke person who called me a Nazi for no reason. I don’t hate people because of who they love or who they are. I may vote “anti-LGBT” because I don’t think are children should be abused with books displaying sexual acts between men.” (Note in case you think I support that sentence, I hated writing it. I’m just quoting republicans that I’ve heard from, because I think it displays how they think). This would prevent the senseless “DEMOCRATS WOKE AND BAD” mentality that most republicans have, because a lot of democrats like to just label them, instead of engage in their thought processes and encourage them to grow as people. Their is a great quote that I try to live my life by “Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle”.

One other note I wanted to make about republicans and democrats that may be more relevant. Because of how america has incidentally become a two party system, often times people may vote for parties they don’t wholly agree with. It would be different to make comments about conservatives, libertarians, communists, and the like. However you are making general statements about parties that have wildly different viewpoints within their own party. Just look at Bernie versus Biden. These voter basis have to be so broad because most other parties have virtually no effect on how the U.S. government is run, most voters have to vote for a party they might heavily disagree with. I’ve met republicans who hold many “democrat” opinions, but vote republican because the democrat party has a history of being anti gun. Leave generalizations of large groups to Nazis and white supremacists.

Some of them are. And screw them. however I know many republicans who would froth at the teeth about such people. Calling such people Nazis is counter productive and only inflames the current issues at hand. I think it is better to say: “There are some republicans who are calling to exterminate LGBTQ+ people, and hold values such as Nazism or white Supremacism. These people are incredibly dangerous, are a blight on our nation, and should be fought against as vigorously as we can. Republicans, Democrats, Capitalists, Socialists, we can and should agree on one fact: FUCK THEM, and FUCK anyone willing to threaten someone else on the mere basis that they are different”. Because it is that line of reasoning why I hear my republican parents saying “The woke media is coming after us and unjustly call us nazis.” and why nothing is done to fix the actual problem, just finger pointing and “bold” political speeches. Edited to remove typo.

Before you read. I made this comment while triggered and rushing. I do not believe that this comment holds the tone that I wanted to coney and I believe that it is poorly written. I leave it up, as I believe it would be a bit of a cop out to delete my comment, I also believe that some of the discourse below is productive and representative of my beliefs. I made a better version of my thoughts here: https://pawb.social/comment/926750.

ah yes. The old tradition of calling you political opponents nazis or communists, or liberals. Wasn’t this the worst part of nazism (ideologically speaking)? Instead of looking at the context, they defaulted to calling all jews spies. Or instead of looking at the struggles that come with integrating different societies and the benefits that come along with that, they just assumed that different races are fundementally incapable of cooperating? Or they saw everyone that didn’t agree with them as fundimentally evil, instead of understanding that there is at least a hint of truth in most phylosphies/political beliefs that they can learn from even if the belief is one that could be considered evil. A great example is abortion: on one hand, you’re litterally erasing the heart beat of another living being before their first breaths. On the other hand, I remember hearing of a 14 year old girl in my area who got pregnant, and you know that baby is done for… especially with the mismnaged mess that is american welfare. I absolutely disagree with many republican beliefs and idioligies, I hate the culture war BS that they petal. I hate watching them wine about cancel culture, and then they cancel a beer company because they gave a single free beer can to a trans woman. I get it, but messages like this only make them think you’re crazy because the idiologies of modern republicans do differ from nazism, maybe for some republicans more than others. But this isn’t helping; because if there is one thing nazism and white supremism feeds off the most… Its the “evil others”.

tldr; there are some differences between nazis and modern republicans (many of these characteristics are better in republicans), and trying to paint them otherwise is just asking for trouble. Acuse others only of what they are guilty.

I made on edit for clarity. I made a second edit because the quote “evil “others”” could technically be construed that I think that the others are in fact evil. I used that language to note how Nazis and white supremism will often assume that others are evil for the mere fact that they are the “others” and I wanted to better get my idea across that this is bad. I made a third edit: I add the (ideologically speaking) line after Wasn’t this the worst part of nazism?. I did this because others were thinking that I thought that was the most awful thing about nazism. The most awful part about nazism was the murdering and mistreatment of innocents. I meant to bring it up as this is the biggest flaw in their ideology. Most Nazis will just devolve into incoherent screaming when you bring up their error of generalizing groups of people.

not really a woosh, I didn’t think that part out fully. I was talking from my perspective where I would be respectful, just as I am with vaping. I know in some parts, i’ve heard it can be really bad. Screw people who just blow it everywhere and make places stink. However there are nearly oderless ways of smoking (particularly vaping) where a smoker can be respectful about it, and just keep it in there car (leave it in your driveway, never drive high). In this case, I don’t see why someone should be upset at the respectfull stoners.

Why is it your problem? I’m not trying to be judgemental, I just don’t see why I should care what others do? It’s not like every stoner is blowing the smoke in your face.

honestly see it both ways. I understand not smoking as I know I never enjoyed the memory troubles when I smoked for like 2 weeks. On the other hand, your body your choice. Sometimes you just want to enjoy something that may not be the greatest for you. I’m not going to pretend that by some wierd logic that I’m better than you, just because I don’t smoke. I know I kind of feel the same way about vaping, not because I need copium to justify my bad habits. I know what you’re going to say, I accept that, and I just want you to leave me alone. It’s non of your business, you’re not my mommy, you’re not my daddy, and if you have a problem with it: just ask me to not do it around that and I’ll be repectfull.