Every country is a mixed economy. Capitalism/Communism as ideology is dumb (like most ideologies). The closest to a fully capitalist country was probably Somalia in the 90s.
I wish everyone would embrace this view so we could start talking implementation details instead of the endless ideological warfare. These capitalists and communists might as well just make a fucking church out of it already, so much dogma.
I have gotten into it with tankies on lemmy.ml on this topic at length. If you are only criticizing historical communism or historical capitalism then you are guaranteed to be fighting a strawman. These ideologies are not even fixed or singular even within the source material, much less in practice. Yet so many people seem unable or unwilling to even engage on conversation about first principles if it doesn’t cleanly fit inside their geopolitical head cannon.
I’d say the US is close to perfectly capitalist, if you have enough money you can just rent legislators and call that “lobbying” (as opposed to renting legislators and callying it “bribing” or “corruption”, which isn’t much better tbf).
The US is very good at playing the democracy/capitalism game. Democracy can’t be sustained by a capitalist economic system by the reasons you pointed out. Once money is involved in the mix, there is no democracy. You can buy everything with money.
Marx, therefore, further refined the concept of a “transition society” and introduced the idea that the development of communist society would take place in two phases. In the first stage, “socialism” as he called it, the commune state was still necessary both to defeat all attempts at counter-revolution and to reconstruct the international economic system on an egalitarian and planned basis.
Marx was too idealistic. He didn’t account for what happens when you put people into power of this “dicatorship of the proletariat”. Most people who get into power are not going to willingly give up power. You’ll end up with self-proclaimed communist countries that are either stuck in this transition phase indefinitely, or end up abandoning it in favor of state capitalism.
Also, you talk a lot of shit about AES countries being forced to engage in capitalism for their survival for someone who also engages in capitalism for your survival. If you’ve got a better way, I’d love to see it.
No shit they’re still in the transition stage. They are still defending against counter-revolution instigated by capitalist world powers, and have not yet overtaken capitalism as the international economic system. Are you unable to read, or are you just being intentionally obtuse?
Saying a state is Communist is shorthand for asserting that it’s on the path to achieving Communism. It’s an uncharted path with many obstacles so just saying “X government did this bad thing therefore it’s not communist/socialist” is very unhelpful, and it really only makes any sort of sense in the context of arguing on the internet
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Right side should read tankies, not communists.
“Communists”
Away with this anarchist nonsense!
To be honest, they are more communist than capitalist countries.
Every country is a mixed economy. Capitalism/Communism as ideology is dumb (like most ideologies). The closest to a fully capitalist country was probably Somalia in the 90s.
How dare you make this not black and white!
I wish everyone would embrace this view so we could start talking implementation details instead of the endless ideological warfare. These capitalists and communists might as well just make a fucking church out of it already, so much dogma.
I have gotten into it with tankies on lemmy.ml on this topic at length. If you are only criticizing historical communism or historical capitalism then you are guaranteed to be fighting a strawman. These ideologies are not even fixed or singular even within the source material, much less in practice. Yet so many people seem unable or unwilling to even engage on conversation about first principles if it doesn’t cleanly fit inside their geopolitical head cannon.
Maybe, but are they more communist than they are capitalist?
If you’re talking about China, no, not really. If you’re talking about everyone else… depends… I’d say mostly.
Name five.
Name five what? Things that make communist countries more communist than capitalist countries?
Just 5 communist countries. I can easily name 25 capitalist countries but only 5 communist countries would be enough for me to shut up.
Truly communist countries? As in perfect communism? That doesn’t exist, as well as truly capitalist countries, that doesn’t exist as well.
I’d say the US is close to perfectly capitalist, if you have enough money you can just rent legislators and call that “lobbying” (as opposed to renting legislators and callying it “bribing” or “corruption”, which isn’t much better tbf).
The US is very good at playing the democracy/capitalism game. Democracy can’t be sustained by a capitalist economic system by the reasons you pointed out. Once money is involved in the mix, there is no democracy. You can buy everything with money.
LMAO red fash isn’t more communist than northern Europe
What is red flash?
Anarchists trying not to be idealistic challenge: impossible
Tell that to the tankies. I’m tired of communism being associated with them.
I stick to the original plan: moneyless, classless, and STATE-less. 🏴
You don’t know your Marx? socialism-transition-communism
Marx: the only moral revolution is my revolution
Marx was too idealistic. He didn’t account for what happens when you put people into power of this “dicatorship of the proletariat”. Most people who get into power are not going to willingly give up power. You’ll end up with self-proclaimed communist countries that are either stuck in this transition phase indefinitely, or end up abandoning it in favor of state capitalism.
Also, you talk a lot of shit about AES countries being forced to engage in capitalism for their survival for someone who also engages in capitalism for your survival. If you’ve got a better way, I’d love to see it.
“Marx was too idealistic” followed by the most idealistic analysis ever
No shit they’re still in the transition stage. They are still defending against counter-revolution instigated by capitalist world powers, and have not yet overtaken capitalism as the international economic system. Are you unable to read, or are you just being intentionally obtuse?
Communism is different from socialism.
Saying a state is Communist is shorthand for asserting that it’s on the path to achieving Communism. It’s an uncharted path with many obstacles so just saying “X government did this bad thing therefore it’s not communist/socialist” is very unhelpful, and it really only makes any sort of sense in the context of arguing on the internet
most “communist” countries is just socialist it is a simple misunderstanding