This community is housed on an instance run by two trans women, focused on the needs of the queer and gender diverse community.
We allowed 196 here because we were promised the community is queer and trans inclusive.
If you’re here it’s because you’re aggressively supportive of trans folk. Not middle of the ground, not “just asking questions”.
If your response to that is, “yes, but…” then this isn’t the instance for you, and by extension, this isn’t the community for you.
tl;dr - Unambiguous support and inclusion, or fuck off somewhere else.
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Edit - I changed the phrase "aggressive support to “unambiguous support”, as there was some confusion over the intent behind my previous phrasing.
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Personally, I don’t think about other people’s sexuality all that much, so I guess that makes me a non-aggressive supporter.
It’s weird to impose this type of stuff, but I respect that this is your little space on the internet, so I’m leaving, as you asked. Thank you for the smiles and laughs.
trans is not a sexuality
That’s for the clarification! Like I said, I’m not super into this whole topic
Aggressive support. I’m with ya.
Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Not to equivocate trans and black liberation because they are very different, but do you think “aggressive” or “non aggressive” supporter of race rights better slots into the whites who demonstrated their unwillingness to go along with racism or the ones who were like “I don’t care about your race, I’m not a racist, but how dare you ask me to support you in any meaningful or visible way?”
Good point! I do think it’s important to support trans rights, but I’d be a hypocrite if I said I AGGRESSIVELY support the cause. There’s just a lot going on in my life right now, I just want to keep a clear mind, is all.
That being said, I never agree with or accept signs of transphobia.
What I mean by aggressively is, without caveats, without “but…”'s, without ambiguity. Your support needs to be clearly on the support side.
You don’t need to be an activist. You don’t need to be out marching or even commenting on trans stuff, but your opinion on trans folks should be unambiguously on the “support” side of things.
Yeah. If someone is ever writing out “I’m an ally, but…” literally nothing good ever follows.
Oh, that’s a much better description. I think I’ll stay for longer then, thank you!
Thanks for replying. I don’t know OPs intent when they said aggressively, but I can’t imagine your description not fitting into some reasonable definitions of allyship. Most people (even queer people) are not hauling themselves to every protest. Calling out transphobia as uncool when seen is as aggressive as anybody needs, imo. I wouldn’t get hung up on the wording.
MILITANT SHITPOSTING
SEIZE THE MEMES OF PRODUCTION
That’s a quote from his letter from Birmingham jail, right?
While there are, of course, major differences in trans and black liberation, I read the full letter again recently and was shocked at how much of it was applicable to the current trans rights movement. I actually get the feeling that the two movements are more alike than they are different.
History repeats itself. I highly encourage everyone to take a half hour and read the full letter. Maybe if everyone took his words to heart, we could avoid some of the bullshit this time around. The conservative playbook of oppression hasn’t changed much. It’s just focused on a different target this time.
I quote that letter regularly, sadly those who need to hear it never do and always try to bring it back to the whitewashed MLK and “non-violence”.
Here are a few articles I linked to someone recently who did that, that others might find interesting:
https://timeline.com/by-the-end-of-his-life-martin-luther-king-realized-the-validity-of-violence-4de177a8c87b
https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2021/1/18/martin-luther-king-jr-was-radical-we-must-reclaim-that-legacy
https://www.history.com/news/for-martin-luther-king-jr-nonviolent-protest-never-meant-wait-and-see
https://www.npr.org/2023/05/15/1175833143/mlk-martin-luther-king-jr-malcolm-x-quote-biography
I agree that there is a great deal to be learned and analogies to be drawn. However, I’m not a person of color so I didn’t want to unilaterally co-opt a movement that isn’t mine to take.
Completely fair, and I totally agree! I’m also not a person of color, so I hope my comment didn’t come across as trying to co-opt the movement. Just wanted to, as you said, point out there are a lot of similarities and lessons that could be learned.
I, as a trans person, fully recognize that black people had it worse than trans people do now. While both communities face violence, black people faced violence that was heavily state-sponsored and far more widespread, even with the recent increased rates of violence against trans people. The entire U.S. legal system was rigged against them from the start. It was their blood that earned us the Civil Rights Act, which is the foundation our movement needed. And that’s a debt we will owe forever. And I also recognize that people of color continue to face discrimination. The fight isn’t over, for any of us.
I’m getting wordy. I think we’re both on the same page here. I guess civil rights discussions get me going (but tbh, I’m okay with that). Hope you have a great day!
Btw, I don’y think “equivocate,” which comes from equivocal, means what you’re trying to say (that you do not wish to position the movements as 1-to-1 matches)
Thanks, I think you’re right! One of those words that somehow formed the wrong definition in my brain. TIL
There was transphobia in 196? HOW?
Most people seem to agree it wasn’t transphobia, but here’s the context: https://lemmy.world/post/1893561
There was some transphobia that came crawling out like usually happens when a trans topic starts getting active, but they got shut down pretty quickly
That is what prompted this post. It happens every single time trans stuff comes up. There is no space for it here.
To be clear, some of the comments you removed were from the person you are now replying to.
Yes, I’m aware. You can see the list here https://lemmy.blahaj.zone/modlog?page=1&userId=170858
They were removed, because a meme community on a trans run instance isn’t the place for a discussion on the specifics of why you don’t want to fuck trans people.
We hear that enough, every day, in every place we look online. We don’t need it here too.
Was the post transphobic? That depends on who you ask, but either way, what it wasn’t is “unambiguously supportive”
It’s also worth pointing out that those posts were not the trigger for this thread
That’s a relief! I was a little worried because I like this instance but was butting heads in the one post. Thank you for running this instance. I threw what money I can at the moment to the blahaj.zone Kofi because I feel bad I might’ve made your job harder as an admin lol
I really wish more people got this
It’s like Pokémon, you made eye contact with someone on a meme sub and suddenly you’re forced into a debate you don’t want to have.
👀 Barbie or Oppenheimer? Answer me, Zymi!
I was thinking about this in the context of a conversation I was privy to recently boiled down it was basically “I don’t have a problem with trans people But…sexually assaulting kids is bad But…teaching sexual orientation to 3 year Olds is bad”
I don’t want to have to feel like I need to “just leave”
The post seems transphobic in a “chaser” sort of way to me, not trans though.
It seems very “chaser” to me. In other comments, the poster mentioned how he was attracted to “post op trans women and pre op trans men”. Grouping those two demographics together in this way will never be seen as not chaser.
What does chaser mean?
Someone who fetishizes trans people. You find trans people hot? That’s totally fine, you can have preferences. But grouping post op trans women and pre op trans men sexually is saying that they’re being viewed as women regardless of their identity.
If you wanna fuck a trans person, it should be because you’re attracted to them. Maybe you like boobs and penis together and that’s fine. Maybe you like a masculine chest and a vagina. You can be attracted to a certain intersection, even if that intersection is a straight one. But fucking them because they’re trans and exotic is chasing. If you like women, fuck trans women. If you like men, fuck trans men. But don’t just randomly flip them around like there’s no difference to you.
Thank you. It was my first time hearing the term.
The guy just said that penises put him off, good god. Is it common in the trans community for people to find it transphobic when cis people aren’t attracted to them post transition? Because while I fully support the right to be trans and transition, that is pretty nuts to find it transphobic just because someone doesn’t find you attractive.
well, yes and no
to my personal experience, it can feel kind of transphobic, as being in the position of being rejected just because of your genitals, and not because of the rest of your personality and appearance/gender expression just feels wrong and mean somehow, but if I try to rationalize it, saying that such pereference is transphobic feels just as bad, as you cant force someones pereference
there needs to be said that the person did not see the implication of praising/complementing someones genitals that were the problem (in the case of the original post “And it would propably be difficult with me going ‘I love your boobs’ and they’re always like ‘I hate my boobs’”). As praising or giving a trans person a complement on the bodyparts which are a big part of their disphoria is just mean and very painfull for most of them (this was propably unintended tho, and I expect the original postter didn’t think about this, but still)
[pre-anything transfem btw]
That’s not the issue. You can’t say “yeah I like women” and then say that includes pre op trans men. That’s fucking gross to say. He literally did the “oh noooo but your boobs!” You guys really go straight to being condescending before you actually try to understand anything, Jesus fucking Christ.
One of the mods made a post about how this comment being really creepy about trans men’s bodies somehow wasn’t transphobic and then deleted it after people started calling them out lol
Thank you for providing good context on this thread. The original comment was ass, but not important overall. If the mod hadn’t decided to explicitly defend it, this wouldn’t even be a conversation. This entire discourse would have been avoided if it wasn’t for a shitty mod post.
Nedankinde. This is an issue we all care about, after all.
Defending it is the only sane response. He was literally asked for his opinion. Is it homophobic for a straight person not find the same gender attractive? Of course not. Then how is transphobic for a cis man not to be into penises? It’s completely bizarre reasoning.
Fuck off.
Genital preferences are valid as far as any preference for physical attributes but when you’re reducing people to purely genitals it’s gross and no respect needs to be given to the argument.
That’s not what happened. In the context of dating and sex it’s an extremely relevant point. Sounds like you’re mad at a headline without reading the article, in a manner of speaking. So you fuck off.
The original comment literally boiled down to “boobs and vagina is woman, penis is man”.
That is not at all what it said. The original commenter said that he would not be willing to date a trans man after they transition because he cannot find a penis sexually attractive and because he does find boons sexually attractive. This is a completely ok thing to say, it’s what was said after this original comment that became a problem. The post should not have been made by the mod, because it led to a lot of transphobes commenting.
No it didn’t. He explained he would be put off by a transitioned trans man. Go through their comment history and you’ll see they’d be comfortable dating preop, as long as their partner is comfortable with them finding their femininity attractive.
The mod could have just… Not responded to it like they don’t respond to thousands of comments. You’re not listening to the point. If you’re straight, don’t fuck trans men because you view them as women because vagina and boob
You’re missing the point. His point was explicitly that he wouldn’t date post op trans men.
What you saying right now was literally his point. To date a trans man because finda him attractive for his femininity wouldn’t work. That was literally his entire point.
The guy said he wasn’t into dicks and that it would be weird to like something about his partner that they would want gone and dislike. That’s not transphobic. It honestly bonkers that people find that to be transphobic.
All in a day’s work😉
Honestly I didn’t realize this was a trans community. I thought ‘196’ was just some random number like the ‘4’ in 4chan. 196 just had good content. The fact it’s inclusive is just a bonus.
It’s not a trans community per se, it’s more of a more trans-friendly shitposting community. Like, I think, even now majority of posters aren’t trans. And majority of content is not trans-themed, it’s not traa. It’s a good place if you don’t want to see only trans-themed memes, but also don’t want to see transphobia
That’s partially to blame for all 196 communities having this weird “if you know you know” approach to writing their mission statement and rules. I’ve seen numerous people ask wth is 196 because of how vague the communities they saw were.
But, particularly about the social politics, here’s also the thing I think. Trans rights are human rights. Communities fall under two categories: Welcoming to trans people, versus inherently evil. So I don’t think that a community is pro-trans should ever have to be stated. It should be assume, and whoever has a problem with it should go fuck off from society, Satan has a place for them.
Tbf, this one does mention it on the about page, so it’s more obvious to newcomers than r/196 was.
The entire instance lemmy.blahaj.zone is a trans themed instance therefore every community on it is slanted towards trans community and support.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blåhaj
Variety makes things better.
100% based; Was already worried where this community was headed
BLÅHAJ Lemmy W
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Which part
The part where
Damn straight. Us queers need to stand together and there can be no god damn LGBTQ+ without the flippin T.
I’m not trying to co-opt anything. Far from. I just want to remind everyone that you don’t need to know your place in the rainbow to want to see its beauty.
Every single transphobe right now:
Literally right below this.
basically lamb glinahan.
Genuinely thank you. This community just existing as it does has already helped me a fucking weird amount.
I’ll be honest I think alienating people feeling in the middle is a bad idea, making an echo chainber is ehat those other websites are for, and people on the middle ground are the ones whose beliefs matter the most as they they are the only ones that will change things.
There shouldnt be any middle ground on the statement “trans rights are human rights”. If you think there’s room for compromise on the oppression of marginalized groups then you’re either a lost cause or willfully ignorant of the world around you. People that are in a safe space, specifically dedicated to them and people like them, have no obligation to educate or entertain disingenuous “discourse” about whether or not they should be allowed to exist.
That’s not what I’m talking about and yeah there’s no middle ground on the fact trans people should have human rights. I’m not sure how to put this into words but pretty much if you live in a place where you can’t see trans people around you (as in trans people not being allowed to be free and safe in public) it’s hard for people to just get a grasp on “this person exists and is trans and is a person” thats the big milestone. Getting people recognised as people. A while before i dated her i didn’t understand how to feel comfortable with the idea (much of it was through fun memes supporting trans stuff in non-toxic ways). But my point is that showing that trans people exist and are normal is really important for the world right now, we need the people in the middle ground to know that your rights are being violated and something needs to be done because the middle does change that vote the most.
Yeah I don’t know any trans people irl so everything I know about them is from 196. I was in no way anti-trans before I started lurking. I would have considered myself the “middle ground” because of my unfamiliarity with it, not because I wasn’t sure if they should or should not have rights. I really think this whole post needs to be rephrased because it would have turned me away back then.
say it louder for the nerds in the back!
lmao “middle ground” ugh
Trans rights are women’s rights.
Trans rights are men’s rights.
Trans rights are human rights.
If you believe otherwise, you’re doing nothing less than questioning the basic humanity of Trans people. And you can fuck right off.
I’m here because this showed up in all.
I don’t “aggressively support” squat. I do stand up for life, liberty,and the pursuit of happiness. Someone being trans does not affect anyone’s life, liberty, or pursuit of happiness until they get aggressive.
What does that even mean?
This like not being racist, but they shouldn’t be so loud with those blm protests?
Not homophobic, but they shouldn’t have to make everything gay in the summer?
Maybe in wrong (I hope I am), but that is what your comment sounds like.
I do not support the BLM protests as they had them because they were violent, yet I support black rights. I understand also Martin Luther King Jrs statement not to have violent protests because it makes the protesters out to be the bad guys.
I was at the Dakota Access Pipeline (DAPL) protests in standing rock protesting against the encroachment of native Americans rights. As and I told them also, "it is not good if you break the law, it makes it look like you are the bad guys. Rather stress how much THEY are breaking the law.
I do not support violent protests for the most part, unless life is at stake.
The law got us in the messes. Ya gotta break it. Property destruction and defense from police violence is not violence.
You think lives aren’t at stake in those instances? Hmm ok.
Why are you showing up in a comment section without having most of the context on a post that doesn’t concern you or your communities? Legit asking, what is the point of this comment?
I did not join this community nor this server, it was thrust upon me.
I support trans rights, don’t get me wrong.
I am just offended by a post thrust upon me and then they claim “this isn’t the community for you”. I DIDN’T JOIN THE DAMN COMMUNITY IN THR FIRST PLACE.
You know you can block a community right? And if it’s not for you, you can just… not participate, too. It was “thrust upon you” in the same way that every other community in c/all is thrust upon you. You make the active choice of browsing non-curated content, then complain that it doesn’t consider you?
Seriously, you’re complaining about literally nothing. If you don’t feel like this is for you, block it.
Yeah, seeing this in all and this person is totally right don’t give em shit
bruh then just shut the fuck up and keep scrolling
This is the weirdest complaint. The post showed up in your popular/active feed because it got popular/active. It wasn’t targeted to you, and the poster was not addressing you. The post was clearly addressed to users who post on /c/196.
Being annoyed at how the service works is not a good reason to be combative with the poster, and it certainly isn’t a good reason to share your opinions about trans folk being a problem when they get aggressive. Not adding up.
You can hide posts and block coummunities without leaving pointless contrarian garbage on them
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Which problems would this solve?
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that is affecting your life… how?
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then you are a failure :)
What makes trans people a cancer?
You just want to murder people and have people pat you on the back for it. The cancer I see is bigotry, because unlike trans people, it is incompatible with society. It spreads and evolves like cancer at the cellular level, taking more and more resources and causing more and more suffering. Eventually, the oppressed will strike back, leading to war both civil and international. Because war has become so destructive, these tensions risk total annihilation of entire societies, cultures, and even the human race.
It’s a societal cancer that lives in your brain, but unlike real cancer, it can be destroyed without killing the cell. You can reject it and become a good person who doesn’t kill people for fun. You just have to choose.
Our life is meaning less, we come and go, so I think the most important thing we can do is to make the time here as pleasant as possible for everyone. I don’t see how your suggestion could prevent suffering. On the contrary, I think it could even lead to more.
Trans rights!
I’m more of a casual user so I haven’t seen the transphobia here but fuck transphobes and you should all have a place to feel safe.
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you are not very smart are you?
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why? im not the one making absolutely nutjob claims that have no roots in reality :)
Trans people are regular, real people. Like my college friend. Or my wife’s HS friend. Or that one kind soul I worked with once.
I’m so god damn sick of all the hatred and lies and bullshit and murder and sadistic laws against trans people.
I loudly applaud any space that actively supports trans people and gives them a place free from hatred and assholes.
The fact that they need a space away from everyone else, and the fact that this post even had to be made, is a testament to mankind’s inhumanity to man. People are people, but there’s an unsettling amount of people that can’t see past creed, color, sexuality, and so on.
I’d say it’s a monument to our own hubris as well. We’re the most advanced civilization that we know exists, but still can’t seem to treat members of our own society right.
TRANS RIGHTS AND SHÖNK
Be friend of Blåhaj